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PistolPatch
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Post by PistolPatch » 1 year ago

Looks like you've picked up a PR1.3T that has been unprotected and then re-protected and someone's accidentally protected those cells :). Could have even been me though I couldn't think why :). The two original PR1.3T files are okay and it's always best to go there for 'fresh' files.

Please do put this in the recipes forum. I reckon put it in any time that suits you as it's a rare recipe. Maybe after brew day?

:luck:
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Post by dmkelgin » 1 year ago

Hi guys,

I’m building up to my first BIAB and have started having a look at BIABacus while I’m gathering the last of the equipment I need. I follow most of whats going on but have a few questions. For my first batch, I’d like to try a recipe like No Short Measures (English Pale Ale) from the BCS book. I’ve had a go at filling in the BIABacus and would appreciate some of the more experienced brewers having a look at what I’ve done so for. I’ve only filled in up to section D as the rest looks reasonably straight forward and I’d rather make sure I have the basics right before moving on.

Original Recipe-
OG: 1.038
FG: 1.011
ADF: 71%
IBU: 32
Colour 10 SRM
Alcohol: 3.6% ABV
Boil 60mins
Pre-Boil Volume 26.5l
Pre-Boil Gravity: 1.033

Grain Bill
British Pale Ale Malt 3.63kg
Crystal (120L) 227g
Special Roast (50L) 113g

Hops
Kent Goldings 5% AA 60min
Kent Golding 5% AA 30min
Kent Golding 5% AA 1min

Heres what I did:

Entered in the dimensions of my kettle (40cm diameter and 48cm height).
Set the Boil for 90mins.
Set the desired VIF to 23l.
Set the recipes OG to 1.038

Entered in the grain bill and hops in sections C and D along with weights.
Played about with the EBC of the British Pale Ale malt until it gave me the same colour as the original recipe (19EBC). This ended up with 2.4EBC for the pale ale malt.

Played about with the original recipes VAW (first line in section D). If I enter in 22.7l as per the book I get an IBU of 28.2
If I change this to 21.82l as I’ve seen recommended in a post on this forum, I get an IBU of 29.4
A setting of 20.05l matches the original recipes IBU of 32.

What exactly should I be aiming for here in regards to the IBU to match the original recipe as closely as possible?

Other questions –
Hop additions - If I increase the boil to 90 mins, instead of the 60 mins the original recipe states, then do I add the 60min hops after 30 minutes, instead of right at the start of the boil? In other words do the hop additions stay at the same time from the end of boil regardless of the length of boil?

Substituting malts – After looking on the Internet, it looks like I will struggle to match the grain bill exactly. Could I substitute for the following:
Crisp Pale Ale Malt (5.7 EBC)
Special Roast (Lovibond 40)
Extra Dark Crystal Malt (340 EBC)

FG and Alcohol % - BIABacus shows my FG as 1.010 (original recipe is 1.011) and alcohol % as 3.7% (original recipe is 3.6%) Are these slight differences just down to rounding or would they have an effect?

One final thing I notice is that the grain bill I will need according to my BIABacus is very similar to the original recipes measurements although the hop bill is close to 30% larger. Is this something I should be scratching my head at?

Thanks for any help.
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Post by PistolPatch » 1 year ago

Good job on your file dmk :salute:

Firstly, in Section D, change the VAW on the first line to 21.82 L as that is what the book works on. Now...

Colours Not Matching

On the left hand side of Section C, your EBC for the Crystal (120° L) should be 237 which will give you an SRM of 120 which is the same as lovibond. Similiarly, for the Special Roast (50° L), change the EBC to 99.

Your colour estimate will now be fairly close to that in the book, however, there is still a discrepancy. This will be due to an incorrect colour formula being used in the original software. The software will be basing the colour formula on the Volume into Fermentor (VIF) instead of Volume of Ambient Wort (VAW). It is a common error, even in some major software. The end result is that it makes the colour estimate higher depending on the Kettle to Fermenter Loss (KFL).

There's a secondary error that can also occur, which relates to wort shrinkage but the above is enough to do your head in for now. In fact, you better sit down for the next section :).

IBU's Not Matching

There are at least five different ways of measuring IBU's, and they all give different results. For example, IBU's can be estimated using one of three formulas (Garetz, Rager and Tinseth), or they can be measured in the laboratory, or they can even be perceived (estimated by tasting). On top of all this, a lot of software uses faulty estimation formulas so things quickly become a mess.

BCS uses the 'Rager' formula and, from memory, Pro-Mash software. This post explains the problem in detail and includes a pic showing how widely, on exactly the same recipe and using the same software, that the IBU estimation formulas vary.

If you read that post and think, "That's crazy!" then pat yourself on the back as you now understand IBU estimates perfectly (seriously).

Hop Boiling Time

Yep, you'll add those 60 minute hops, 30 minutes after the boil begins. You can if you want, add them at 75 mins which will mean you'll need slightly less bittering hops. To work this out, on the right hand side of Section D, type in the AA% of the hops you'll be purchasing, and type in 75 under the Mins on the right hand side.

Malt Substitution

I'm not great at this part of brewing. One thing I do know though is that flavour is a lot more important than colour, and, no software calculates flavour. My advice would be to research the original malts and focus on their flavour, then do the same for your proposed substitutions.

Also, maybe someone else who's better at this side than me, might see our post and jump in. Off the top of my head, the only one of your subs that worries me is the Extra Dark Crystal Malt. I'm not worried about it making the beer darker if the same percentage is used, I'm worried about what the difference in flavour is between the two malts. A bit of Googling might help - not sure? Let us know if you do find an answer. If no luck, you could start a whole new thread on this part of your recipe.

FG and Alcohol Percentage

Different yeasts have different abilities to eat up your sugars. Yeasts that eat up a heap of sugar are called high-attenuating yeasts. Those that don't eat up as much are low attenuating yeasts. More info on this here. The BIABacus, as a default, assumes that your yeast is an average yeast and will attenuate to 75%. The BCS book will have given the software a more accurate estimate based on the yeasts being recommended. In Section H, if you type 72 into the fourth line down, you'll find your FG's will match. The difference in the ABV will be due to, as you suggested, rounding differences.

When you brew this beer though, you should not expect the Final Gravity to be bang on 1.011. It is normal for a FG to stray from estimates for many reasons.

Grain Bill the Same Size but Hop Bill is Bigger???

The first thing to notice, is that you ae not brewing the same size batch as in BCS. Their VAW is 21.82 L whilst yours is 26.83 L (see Section K). So that's the hop part of the question answered; you need more hops, because, you are brewing a larger batch.

All brewing software (besides the BIABacus) forces the user into estimating their kettle efficiency. [If you want more detail on kettle efficiency, read this thread.] To change it is often an extremely difficult thing to do as some software doesn't even allow you to change kettle efficiency, only fermenter efficiency. Because of this, most brewers using other software never change the default. The BCS recipes are no exception, they are using the same kettle efficiency for high gravity brews as low gravity brews.

The BIABacus looks at several factors in your recipe to work out how well you are going to be able to wash the grain. Your recipe is a low gravity recipe which will wash cleaner than a high gravity one. In fact, if you go to Section P, the BIABacus estimates your kettle efficiency will be 86.5%. (It will go even higher if you add a mash-out step in Section E).

The BCS book works on a generic 70% kettle efficiency for all recipes, but, with your recipe, that generic figure is way too low. This is why you should never override the auto-efficiency without a good reason.

...

Hey, I wrote all that sober!

How's your head dmk? :P

That's a lot to take in above so take your time and ask any questions you have. The hardest thing about taking in the above, I think, is accepting that there is so much inaccuracy in recipes.

There is very little knowledge written on any of the above, for obvious reasons, (actually, they aren't that obvious) but I think that is enough for one post.

:shock:
PP
Last edited by PistolPatch on 22 Mar 2016, 14:21, edited 6 times in total.
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Post by dmkelgin » 1 year ago

Wow, thanks for all that PP. Right, I’ve changed a few things and am happier with the output and my understanding of how things link together. Still got a few questions though 

I changed the VAW back to 21.82l

The EBC for the Crystal 120L and Special Roast malt I got from entering the lovibond value into a conversion website (https://www.brewtoad.com/tools/color-converter are the formulas on this website just plain wrong?). I should have picked up the discrepancy here. I’ve changed them now to Crystal 237 EBC and Special Roast 99 EBC. Also changed the EBC of the British Pale Ale malt to 5.5 EBC as this seems to be a more common value for this type of malt (I could be way of the mark here). Anyway, this gives me a final EBC of 17.5. Original recipe states 10 SRM which would be about 19.7 EBC. Would this be within the expected difference range?

I kind of understand the differences in IBU’s, need to do a lot more reading to understand it more fully though. I’ve now got a bitterness of 29.4 IBU instead of the original recipes 32 IBU. Again, would this be within the expected range?

Hop boiling time – Is there any advantage to moving the first hop addition from 60 minutes to 75minutes apart from the fact it would save a few grams of hops? Is there any downside to adding the hops earlier in the boil?

Malt substitutions – My main concern here was with the colours rather than the flavours (yes, it sounds the wrong way to go to me as well ). Anyway, the Dark Crystal Malt I looked at online had an EBC of 340 which is close to wrong EBC I had entered in for the Crystal malt. Based on your correction PP I would be looking for a crystal malt with an EBC of closer to 240. My main concern at this stage is being able to recreate a recipe as accurately and as similar to the original as possible. When I am happy I can do this then I will be a lot more comfortable altering the grain bill to meet my own tastes.

FG and alcohol percentage – That makes sense to me 

Grain bill same size but hop bill bigger – thank you, this difference now makes more sense to me also.

Overall, I think matching malts is going to be my biggest problem/challenge as several I see do not seem to be available in all/many home brew suppliers.

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Post by Mad_Scientist » 1 year ago

Welcome dmkelgin to the forum! :salute:

What are your sources there in Scotland? Maybe we can help you with substitutions if we knew this. :dunno:

Crisp is British, so Best Ale Malt or Extra Pale Malt are the substitutions for this, if you can get Crisp products.

MS

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Post by Mad_Scientist » 1 year ago

Crisp also makes a crystal 120 °L, so go with that too.


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Post by dmkelgin » 1 year ago

I do have access to Crisp products over the Internet but because my location is classed as "remote" postage charges are high. Because of this I would prefer to get all the malts needed from the same company. The annoying thing is that Crisp have a malting plant about 20 miles from where I live so malts will get transported hundreds of miles to the larger online distributors, then posted back up to me :roll:


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Post by PistolPatch » 1 year ago

Good to see MS is helping you to tackle your malt substitution problem. Maybe put your location in your user profile as this might help get an answer from others as well. A good question from you on SRM and Lovibond...

That's my Error on the Colour

I got this bit wrong sorry dmk. I'll explain why. Firstly, don't know why, I thought you had just changed the colours until they matched what you wanted :). Secondly, I had forgotten the SRM to Lovibond conversion formula, which, is very amusing, as I wrote the Colour Conversion section of The BIABacus - see the top right on the second sheet. Here's why my brain failed me...

Hold your head on, again :interesting:.

I haven't studied beer colour for about 4 years and it's a really confusing area. For a start, there's the old EBC and new EBC measurement methods, but many brewers still use the old EBC laboratory method which requires a different formula to convert to SRM - see here. On top of that, you have the situation where beer colour was measured for years in °Lovibond whereas now (but not always :roll:), beer colour in the US is measured in SRM. Because SRM and Lovibond were almost identical visually (any beer over about 22 SRM appears black), SRM and Lovibond were often used interchangeably but the fat more precise conversion is what the BIABacus uses and what the converter you found uses.

So, a good reminder for me. Let's see if I can summarise...

As a general rule, grain colour in the US is measured in °Lovibond whereas beer colour is measured in SRM. In Europe, I don't think they measure the grain colour (not completely sure on this), only the colour the grain produces when a sample (mixed with water) is measured with a spectrometer. Beer colour is measured when a beer sample is measured with a spectrometer.

The long and short of it is that you did the right thing.

Your other Colour Question.

Firstly, stick with the colours you know for sure. In other words, leave the Crystal as 318.7 EBC and the Roast at 131.9. As for the colour of the British Pale Ale Malt, which is not given in the recipe, this could be anything but I think your 6.5 EBC might be a better average even though it is going to put you further away from the book's 'total colour'.

Put those in and you'll get 24.1 EBC / 12.2 SRM compared to the books 19.7 / 10.

I'm at a loss on this. You can try this in another program, and, assuming you are using the EBC's, weights etc,. we have, you'll get the same result or, even higher due to the VIF versus VAW problem I mentioned in my last post.

I'd have to go through some of the other BCS recipes to see if this is a consistent problem. Perhaps, °L was made to equal 1 SRM (same error I did?).

One last thing (and this isn't the answer to the discrepancy), the colour estimate formulas we use in software are very much approximations and have some obvious flaws. As I said in my last post, don't go religiously trying to match colour. For example, kettle efficiency will affect the colour that your software estimates. Look at the left and right hand sides of Section C and you'll see a difference. We have to use less grain than the original recipe to get the same amount of sugar as our kettle set-up is more efficient. Does this also mean we can also get the same colour with the lower grain bill? I don't know, however, it is not an area that is of concern or interest to me. As long as I'm getting the same amount of sugars and flavours, that is what matters.

IBU's

Looks like your brain is having trouble accepting the many problems we have with IBU estimations. Did you see that pic in the post I linked? Here is the link again as it sort of gets lost in all the text I wrote.

Look at the Burton Ale recipe. If you use Rager to estimate the IBU's, you get 45.3, whereas if you use Tinseth, you get 34.6. Same recipe, same equipment and same software. Crazy eh?

Given that alone, let alone all the other possible problems that are mentioned in that link, and a few I didn't mention, 29.4 Tinseth versus 32 Rager is perfectly acceptable.

So, don't read more. Instead, just read that link slowly, with a beer, and let it sink in.

Hop Boiling

No advantage apart from what you said. In some recipes, you may only want bitterness and no flavour from the hop, so you would consider moving it to 75.

One Final Really Important Thing

It's very easy to hold numbers up as Gods or, to try and copy a recipe perfectly. Given some of the problems we've already explored, you also have poor terminology or a lack of information. Crystl 120L from Briess might have different characteristics from Crisp's for example. Those individual maltsters also might have one batch of their pale ale malt being 5.5 EBC and the next 7.5 EBC.

Also, hops can vary, not only in AA percentage, each year but, also flavour.

Even with all these so-called 'worries', the real truth is that even though you're ingredients will never be identical to the recipe you are trying to duplicate, even if one or two of your substitutions are 20% off say, you will get an excellent beer!

You have your numbers, so just choose one shop, and then get the most appropriate malts. And, if it is a knowledgeable shop, they'll be able to help with your substitutions.

It's time for you to brew :party:,
PP
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Post by Lumpy5oh » 1 year ago

Dmk
Many people get hung up on colour. PP mentioned this in his posts but I want to highlight it incase it got lost in all the knowledge.
We can't taste colour. It is much more important to try and match flavor than colour. Briess has an excellent site listing their grains and describing the flavors. I don't know if the company you will be looking at will as well. I was hung up on colour as well when I first started and don't think I've given it much thought in the last couple of years.
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Post by dmkelgin » 1 year ago

Ok, after much head scratching I think I’m happy.
Malt colour – EBC is roughly 2xSRM, SRM is roughly half EBC. Lovibond is equal to SRM. Lovibond is used to measure the colour of malts, SRM is the American system to measure the colour of wort, EBC is the European system to measure wort colour. Fine, makes sense.
Throw in the older calculations between EBC and SRM/Lovibond and I get confused. Good thing is that colour doesn’t really matter, so if the figures don’t match then hey-ho :roll:
IBU’s – Like colour, the figures don’t really mean anything as there are so many variations/systems. This measurement will be important when I want to tweak a recipe I’ve already brewed with the same/very similar malts, but until then I can take the measurement with a pinch of salt.
So, what is important – A recipe is simply a starting point. Grain bill gives you the percentages of the different grains and it is then up to me to “best match” malts, concentrating on flavours.
Hops – these look much simpler if the %AA are accurate although there are going to be (sometimes large?) variations between batches.
I feel like I’m good to go. All I need to do now is get my burner and a couple of other minor pieces of kit. Aiming for doing my first brew in about 2 months time or so. Just got 3 kits to rattle out first :drink:
Thanks again everyone.

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Post by mally » 1 year ago

Nice summary dmkelgin, quite succinct.

Oh.. good luck BTW
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Post by CarmineM74 » 1 year ago

Hi everyone,

I've a question about strike temperature and BIABacus, my system is a RIMS and from my understandings
the strike temperature is computed for a kettle on the burner. On the temporary help there's a reference about
that topic that suggests to change the "0.2" to "0.4". On the version PR1.3T, tough, there is a box which
accepts values from 1 to 5, 1 being suitable for the usual "kettle on the burner". Which value am I supposed
to insert there?

May I post the results, for my recipe, from the BIABacus here?

Thanks for your help


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Post by PistolPatch » 1 year ago

Before getting to CarminieM74's question, mally wrote pretty much the exact reply I was going to write to dmkelgin's last post :P. (Pedantic as I am, one correction... Lovibond isn't equal to SRM, but on paler colours isn't that far off). The main thing is that dmk has discovered that a lot about colour and IBU's doesn't make much sense which means he's got it! :lol:

CarmineM74 Strike Temp Question

Forget the 0.2/0.4 business. That advice was based on a much earlier version of the BIABacus. To make things far more user-friendly, later versions of the BIABacus changed the formula so that you could just type in whole numbers from 1 to 5. 1 is for heavy equipment such as a thick-based kettle sitting on a heavy base and 5 is for light equipment such as an urn. (You can even use non-whole numbers if you want). If this doesn't make sense, I'll dig out the old and new formulas.

For you with the RIMS, I think from your pic in this thread, that the re-circulated 'liquor' can be heated as it is pumped??? If so, I think stick with 1 or 2 as your heater will soon stabilise the mash temp; the main thing is not to strike too high. If your RIMS didn't have a heater, from the look of your pic, I'd probably start at 3 (and on alter brews, expect to go higher) as the kettle is thin-walled and has no base so the thermal capacity is low.

Make sense?
PP
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Post by CarmineM74 » 1 year ago

Well, my system does have an heater element through which the wort is constantly flowing and heated. So, for now, I won't fiddle with the strike temperature adjustment and will let the PID do its magic.

After all it won't be a few more settlement seconds to endanger my brew.
:thumbs:


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Post by littledingle » 1 year ago

Im trying a recipe from brewing classic styles

the pale choc is a Thomas Fawcett with an EBC of 500-800. I use a 2400w emmersion heater, not sure if that changes anything from an induction or gas fired heater? My pot is pretty thin walled but is insulated with a 1" gym mat. Just want to see if I've put everything in ok

Just noticed the recipe credit doesnt get sent to the recipe report page? This is either John Palmer or Jamil zainasheff.

BIABacus Pre-Release 1.3T RECIPE REPORT BIAB Recipe Designer, Calculator and Scaler. (Please visit http://www.biabrewer.info" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; for the latest version.) Nutty Man Brown Ale - Batch A0 Recipe Overview

Brewer: littledingal
Style: Southern English Brown
Source Recipe Link:
ABV: 3.6% (assumes any priming sugar used is diluted.)

Original Gravity (OG): 1.041
IBU's (Tinseth): 12.5
Bitterness to Gravity Ratio: 0.3
Colour: 48.4 EBC = 24.6 SRM

Kettle Efficiency (as in EIB and EAW): 88 %
Efficiency into Fermentor (EIF): 79.3 %

Note: This is a Pure BIAB (Full Volume Mash)

Times and Temperatures

Mash: 90 mins at 67 C = 152.6 F
Boil: 90 min
Ferment: 14 days at 20 C = 68 F

Volumes & Gravities
(Note that VAW below is the Volume at Flame-Out (VFO) less shrinkage.)
The, "Clear Brewing Terminology," thread at http://www.biabrewer.info/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Total Water Needed (TWN): 38.2 L = 10.09 G
Volume into Boil (VIB): 35.66 L = 9.42 G @ 1.031
Volume of Ambient Wort (VAW): 25.53 L = 6.74 G @ 1.041
Volume into Fermentor (VIF): 23 L = 6.08 G @ 1.041
Volume into Packaging (VIP): 21.3 L = 5.63 G @ 1.013 assuming apparent attenuation of 69 %

The Grain Bill (Also includes extracts, sugars and adjuncts)

Note: If extracts, sugars or adjuncts are not followed by an exclamation mark, go to http://www.biabrewer.info" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; (needs link)

71.6% maris otter (5.9 EBC = 3 SRM) 2874 grams = 6.34 pounds
10.3% crystal malt 80l (157.6 EBC = 80 SRM) 413 grams = 0.91 pounds
6.5% cystal malt 120l (236.4 EBC = 120 SRM) 261 grams = 0.57 pounds
5.2% special roast 50l (98.5 EBC = 50 SRM) 208 grams = 0.46 pounds
3.9% pale chocolate 200l (700 EBC = 355.3 SRM) 156 grams = 0.34 pounds
2.6% carafa special II 430l (811.6 EBC = 412 SRM) 104 grams = 0.23 pounds



The Hop Bill (Based on Tinseth Formula)

12.5 IBU EKG Pellets (5%AA) 23.1 grams = 0.816 ounces at 60 mins








Mash Steps

Mash Type: Pure BIAB (Full-Volume Mash): Saccharifiaction for 90 mins at 67 C = 152.6 F

#VALUE!




Mashout for for 15 mins at 174 C = 345.2 F




Miscellaneous Ingredients








Chilling & Hop Management Methods

Hopsock Used: y (Pulled 0 mins after boil end.)

Chilling Method: nochill

Fermentation & Conditioning

Fermentation: s-04 8 gm rehydrated for 14 days at 20 C = 68 F

Secondary Used: n
Crash-Chilled: n
Filtered: n
Req. Volumes of CO2: 1
Serving Temp: 11 C = 51.8 F
Condition for 30 days.


Special Instructions/Notes on this Beer

going to try for 1 lolly drop per bottle to hit 1 vol. but maybe not.

:drink:
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Post by PistolPatch » 1 year ago

Before I forget, 1 Coopers Carbonation drop/lolly in a 750ml bottle, will be a bit flat. An an APA or a lager/pilsner, two drops work really well. Let's say that gives 2.5 Vols CO2. In your BIABacus, you have typed in 1 Vol CO2 however the style guideline say between 1.3 and 2.3 Vols CO2*. 1 lolly (3.5 grams of sugar/glucose) will probably get you 1.3 volumes but if you want to go for 1.8 Vols, maybe add an extra 1.5 grams of table sugar per bottle - don't know how you'd measure that easily though - maybe something like these? Shame those lollies are impossible to snap in half. (As a matter of interest, I once had an American Pale Ale where the brewer had primed half the batch with lollies and the other half with white table sugar. The difference was amazing! I definitely preferred the lolly beer.)

*Just noticed in the book it says 1.0 to 1.5 Vols so ignore the above if you like ;).

Your BIABacus

You've done a fantastic job on this :thumbs:.

Only changes beside the carbonation mentioned above are:

1. First line of Section D - change to 21.82 L. That is the VAW we have worked out for the BCS recipes.
2. 14 days fermentation with this beer and that yeast, is quite long. It will be finished in seven days, no problem.

Other Notes

Use a blow-off tube as SO4 gets violent. I know the book says ferment at 20C but I would pitch at 17C and let it find its own way to 20. If you pitch at 20, it will want to go higher, quickly. It's always a good rule to pitch a few degrees under anyway.

Rather than rehydrating, aerate your wort vigorously so as there are lots of bubbles on top and then sprinkle the yeast on top of that. For me, this is a safer method than rehydrating. For example, yeast does not like chlorine so rehydrating in crappy water will do more harm than good. It's also easy to get temps wrong when rehydrating. Sprinkling on the top of the foam, in my mind, allows the yeast to adjust to the temperature and gravity. I've never heard of any "sprinkler" having any problems.

Nice job!
PP
Last edited by PistolPatch on 01 May 2016, 15:02, edited 6 times in total.
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Post by littledingle » 1 year ago

ooohhh many thanks!

I think its more of a testament to the fact that biabucus works thanks to you fellahs a hellva lot more than me being able to read (and still getting it wrong!). well Ill do a brew next weekend and post results, I think thats what you guys want?

as to our other discussion Ill be doing a plate chill thingy but meh.

I wonder if there is a clean way to cut those lollies in half... or maybe get the manufacturer to make em in 1/2's? or even 1/4's hmmm?. Those spoons would work, youde want to compact the sugar down? and than gently scrape off the top? I wonder if you could could make your own molds for those drops... What do those guys use anyway? I really like skipping the bottle bucket thingy. But on the flip side Im saving for a keg system.

And Ill definatley do the blow off tube after a good shaking. I have never done a reH20, so Im glad you said that. :salute:
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Post by Evanspa » 1 year ago

.
Last edited by Evanspa on 21 May 2016, 02:54, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by Mad_Scientist » 1 year ago

Does Charlie have an efficiency listed for this one or all of them in his book?

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Post by thughes » 1 year ago

That's what I was thinking too, MS. Looks like Charlie is getting some really lousy efficiency. Evanspa, I'd say go with the 5 something pounds the BIAB specifies and see what happens.


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Post by Evanspa » 1 year ago

.
Last edited by Evanspa on 21 May 2016, 02:55, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by thughes » 1 year ago

Brew it and let us know....

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Post by PistolPatch » 1 year ago

Evanspa wrote:I noticed the original grain bill was 19+ lbs. for a 5.5Gal batch...
I noticed your post yesterday Evanspa and just did a bit of research on it.

Just quickly, on the left hand side of Section C, never type in a "percentage" sign. For some reason, once you do, you can never get rid of the damn thing, you basically have to load up a fresh BIABacus file.

Okay, here's what went through my mind...

Firstly, why would an imperial porter ("imperial" means high ABV) have such a low original gravity? I then Googled "Denny Conn's Bourbon Vanilla Imperial Porter Recipe," and the first thing I saw on the Google page was, "Originally created by Denny Conn and spread around the various internet forums." Uh oh :nup:.

I checked that link and the OG was 1.079. Next, I looked for the earliest link I could find as often that will be the one with the least distortion. I found a 2004 post written by Denny Conn.

You'll see there that the OG is 1.087, grain percentages, mash schedules etc are totally different between those two versions and also yours :o. See how the recipes become distorted over time?

The First Question

The first question to answer is which "version" do you want to use? There's the one above or there's one here with some notes from Denny but I can't find the date of that version.

There might be other versions out there that also have notes from the original author?

Once that's Answered

Once that is answered, the key bit of info to find is the Volume of Ambient Wort of the recipe you have chosen to copy which can often be hard to work out in some recipes.

In the first recipe (tastybrew) it says that the Batch Size and Wort Size are both 5 gallons (18.93L). In this case, I can see the author also means that the Volume of Ambient Wort is 5 gallons (there's a few easy ways you can investigate this in the BIABacus).

In the second recipe (brew365), it just says "6 Gal" so we have no idea what the author means by that. Once again, using the BIABacus to investigate, I would use 6.21 Gal (23.5 L) as the Volume of Ambient Wort. This also tells me that the original author probably meant Volume into Fermenter when they said "6 gal).

....

Let us know what version you choose. I'd definitely start a fresh BIABcaus file so as to get rid if that percentage problem.

If you choose a version not listed here, one of us will be able to help or show you how to "investigate" the VAW of the original recipe although, sometimes that can be impossible.

Please put your new file up regardless. We can not only check it but maybe we can also post it up in it's own thread in the recipe forum.

:party:,
PP
Last edited by PistolPatch on 09 May 2016, 12:03, edited 6 times in total.
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Post by Evanspa » 1 year ago

?
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Post by Evanspa » 1 year ago

.
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