First Step Mash BIAB and Rice.

Post #1 made 7 years ago
Well just finished my third BIAB. This time with adjuctants. Rice. And my first step mash. Wow what a day. It was a learning experience and getting the idea of the correct temps for the steps. I used Zwickel's step mash that he posted on the cream ale or somewhere here. Also I cooked my rice before using 10% of my grain weight to add to the rice. I boiled the rice and grain then made sure the lid was sealed and turned it off and wrapped it all up in towels and left on the stove top till the morning.

Woke up and started the mash and found that the rice was steel warm so was ready to add for the first rest.

Anyway here was the recipe
BeerSmith Recipe Printout -
Recipe: Cerveza de Alita
Brewer: Aussiechucka
Asst Brewer:
Style: German Pilsner (Pils)
TYPE: All Grain
Taste: (35.0)

Recipe Specifications
Batch Size: 18.00 L
Boil Size: 21.70 L
Estimated OG: 1.044 SG
Estimated Color: 6.5 EBC
Estimated IBU: 23.4 IBU
Brewhouse Efficiency: 75.00 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Amount Item Type % or IBU
3.00 kg Pilsner Pale Malt (4.0 EBC) Grain 81.08 %
0.70 kg Rice, Flaked (2.0 EBC) Grain 18.92 %
30.00 gm Tettnang [4.50 %] (60 min) Hops 19.1 IBU
15.00 gm Saaz [4.00 %] (15 min) Hops 4.2 IBU
0.50 items Whirlfloc Tablet (Boil 10.0 min) Misc
1 Pkgs SafLager West European Lager (DCL Yeast #SYeast-Lager

Mash Schedule: Zwickels Step Mash
Total Grain Weight: 3.70 kg
Zwickels Step Mash
Step Time Name Description Step Temp
20 min Protein Rest Add 9.25 L of water at 54.6 C 52.0 C
30 min Step 2 Add 0.00 L of water at 63.0 C 63.0 C
30 min Step 3 Add 0.00 L of water at 72.0 C 72.0 C
10 min Mash out Heat to 78.0 C over 10 min 78.0 C

1056 @ 51 before sparge . Sparge with boil water at 3litres. 1050 @ 50 after 2nd sparge with 3 litres 1046 @ 50

Into no chill cubes and wait and get starter ready.

Anyway all in all it seemed to go well, just a bit of time doing the step mash. Hopefully all the effort it will taste Ok. will try the started with S-23 but it is past it date so if it doesn't fire wil just start up some US-05 for a cream ale.

Post #2 made 7 years ago
Good on ya aussiechucka, Keep us posted on how it turns out. ;)
"All right, brain. You don't like me and I don't like you, but let's just do this and I can get back to killing you with beer."
[/i] Homer Simpson K.I.S.S., B.I.A.B.[/b]

Post #3 made 7 years ago
will do just popped it into the fermenter so will be some time but the taste going into the fermenter was great. Got a pretty good efficiency. around the 75% mark I think i am going to get a stronger brew than I was hoping for. Oh well I am sure I will drink it.
Drinking my Wells Bombadier AG at the moment. I am really happy with the result of it, very close to Bombadier even though I tasted 6 years agao. :)

Post #4 made 7 years ago
Top work aussiechucka, my last brew made was a cream ale :)

My recipe was;
Pilsner 91%
Rice 9%

Mt hood @ 60 minutes 16 IBU
Mt Hood @ 20 minutes 5 IBU

Dantstar Nottingham ale yeast.

I ended up with 29 litres @ 1046 OG. It's still in the fermenter, but tasting very nice.

Just a couple of questions on yours. Your recipe looks fine other than using lager yeast, surely if you use a lager yeast, it will not be a cream ale.

Why add grain to your rice and leave it overnight? What does this achieve?

Last edited by hashie on 15 Aug 2010, 05:59, edited 5 times in total.
"It's beer Jim, but not as we know it."

Post #5 made 7 years ago
Hi Hashie,
Yeah I know I was changing my mind what I was brewing. Ended up Brewing a lager (I think) I am using the S-23 anyway and brewing it at 10 degrees.
Anyway to answer your question about where I got the idea of from the aussiehombrewer former from another member. I think it worked well as I did a shorter mash and I am sure I converted all of the rice. Here is what he said.

Any adjunct (rice, maize, wheat and barley etc) has starch in granules; these are grouped in little parcels surrounded by protein, to use the starch and convert it to sugar we have to get it into a state that lets the enzymes in the malt degrade it into sugar in the mash.
Analogies are rarely accurate but in this case might help get the idea across – let's say you had a lump of concrete and that the part you want is the aggregate (sic the starch granules), if you dissolved the cement away with acid you would be left with a pile of gravel.
This is one of the things that happens during malting; enzymes like B-Glucanase breaks up the protein that surrounds the starch granules, like the acid dissolves the cement.

Next is to unravel the starch, it is stored in the corn* as tightly wound up strands, this is called gelatinisation. The starch takes up water and swells (ever cooked white rice? Then you know what I mean by swells up) and becomes available to the enzymes when you start mashing.
It's very important to note that different types of grain have very different gelatinisation temperatures. Barley gelatinises at mashing temperatures but most grains don't, this table gives the range of gelatinisation temperatures for some common brewing ingredients.
TableAttached File Gelatinization_Temperatures.xls ( 17K ) Number of downloads: 19

Now just because one end of the gelatinisation range is in the mashing range that doesn't mean that the grain you have will gelatinise at that end of the range, it will gelatinise somewhere in that range so you must cover all of the range.

One common practice is to slowly heat the adjunct with a portion of your malt (usually about 10%). The enzymes in the malt (like Glucanase) aid with the breaking up of the protein matrix, once you get to about 80 oC the enzymes are all denatured and you can pile on the heat and boil the mix until its fully gelatinised. Just follow the same procedure as you would if you were cooking rice for dinner. Actually mixing your rice and some malt together and throwing it in a rice cooker works a treat. Adding some malt isn't mandatory, just well cooked rice will work but including the malt works better.

If you want to do a boil you can use the boiled rice and water as part of your strike water, or you can prepare the adjunct in a rice cooker the day before and let it cool, then just use the solid portion as part of your grist, again not a right wrong thing, just what works out easiest for you.
The haze you are getting is likely to be starch haze from not properly preparing your adjunct, so you are gelatinising some of the starch in the kettle after the enzymes are no longer effective. The problem with what you're talking about doing is that you haven't fixed the cause of the problem.

Hopefully this helps some people.

Post #6 made 7 years ago
Thanks Chucka, I think I understand what is written there. I don't fully agree with it but, as I'm no expert, I'm happy to go along with it.
"It's beer Jim, but not as we know it."

Post #7 made 7 years ago
Yeah I am not too sure it will work that well but hey why not give it a shot. if it is no good I will just do a preboil with only rice and then make my mash longer when doing my mash to eat up all of the starch etc from the rice. I will let you know how this one turns out.

Post #8 made 7 years ago
I have been drinking this Lager now, and I love it. It doesn't have a very hoppy aroma but goes down very easy. SWMBO loves it too so will have to get cracking to make another one. The only probable down side of this beer was it does have a bit of chill haze, so next time I will make sure I do a proper cereal mash to make sure I break down that rice starch.
Anyway just thought I would report back on how this turned out as I only gave it three weeks to carb up and one to two weeks cold conditioning. So I now know I can do a lager that will be ready to drink under a month.

Post #10 made 7 years ago
aussiechucka wrote:Anyway just thought I would report back on how this turned out as I only gave it three weeks to carb up and one to two weeks cold conditioning. So I now know I can do a lager that will be ready to drink under a month.
Chucka, please explain the under a month bit.
how long did you ferment at 10C? and than bottle conditioned and than cold lagering?
and all that in under a month?
I have not yet brewed a lager and I'm trying to get as much info as i can before i go for it.

Last edited by shibolet on 10 Oct 2010, 20:54, edited 5 times in total.
fermenter: Sourdough Spelt Ale, Classic Lambic, Oud Brune, Barrel Aged Belgian Dubbel
Kegs: Bob's Black IPA, Blanc Blond, Soda...
to be brewed:

Post #11 made 7 years ago
Having said I did that all within a month I will have to say I only was bottle conditioning for a month from when I bottle the beer. I was mainly looking at the top of the bottle, which was dated 3/9. Start drinking that three weeks after bottling. Three weeks at room temp then crash chilled to 0 degrees for a few days. I cracked a few and was pretty happy with the taste, no off flavours. My mate had a good few the other day and he was impressed. I think it probably could do with a bit more hops taste but the missus is very happy with the finished result.
Here are my fermenting notes
"Into ferment on the 14th of August used Saf S23 Tasted really good going into the fermenter. FG 1.011 Put in diacetyl rest at 16 degrees. Friday arvo 27th August will crash chill0 degrees for three day then bulk prime and bottle. Will bottle Friday using 120gm to bulk prime. Bulk primed on Friday the 3rd of September. "
So hope this helps. I am only new at all grain but very happy with the results. Will be doing another one before summer as SWMBO has put her order in. :)Sorry for making the mistake of saying all done in under a month, but I was talking about the conditioning.
Let me know if you have any more questions I might be able to help or somebody with more experience.
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